When the Past Resurfaces: Navigating Repressed Memories and the Aftermath of Trauma

Transcript of conversation with Laurence Willis published 4 March 2026

Transcript prepared by JAS Virtual Services.

You can watch this conversation here or listen here.

Today we are joined by Laurence Willis who bravely opens up about his personal journey and experiences, offering insight into recovery and resilience. Laurence, really glad to see you again. Thanks for joining us.

Laurence Willis [00:00:39]:

Hi, nice to meet you. Hi David.

David Jones [00:00:42]:

Well, hi Laurence, and really good to meet you, and thanks so much for coming along today. Laurence, can you tell us a little bit about how your world changed when you adopted two children at the age of 40?

Laurence Willis [00:01:00]:

I believe that my childhood was very stable, certainly the parts that I could remember. And I definitely recall that if people spoke about trauma, that I didn’t see myself as ever being part of that conversation. I don’t think I actually understood trauma. While adoption itself is quite beautiful, and I definitely say it’s been one of the most purposeful decisions I’ve made in my life, I think it also requires regulation and patience and very much a deep self-awareness. But what I didn’t expect when I adopted was that there would be another child in the family, and particularly such a volatile child. And so it was shock for all of us. I became overly strict. I was very demanding.

Laurence Willis [00:02:13]:

I was definitely extremely hypervigilant. And what I now recognise it was me being triggered, it was totally alien to me. I just did not recognise it. And the professionals that we were working with, were increasingly pleading with me to take part in therapy. On the basis that if I did not, that they thought I would rip the family apart. Their view was that I’d had a very punitive upbringing because of the way I was trying to bring up my children. And I can definitely see that looking back on that. My reactions were creating a lot of tension in the home.

Laurence Willis [00:03:08]:

I thought I was trying to create order, but I was escalating everything.

David Jones [00:03:15]:

So can I just get it straight in my mind, Laurence? So you’re saying that you were the third child, or a part of you was the third child, and the way you’re behaving in this hypervigilant, rather strict manner was different from your, previously experienced everyday personality. Is that right?

Laurence Willis [00:03:47]:

Absolutely, David. I was definitely behaving like a child constantly. I was behaving like a child. I was reacting like they were reacting. I was getting angry like they were getting angry, and all of that was totally alien to how I had been before and took us, took both Mark, my husband, and I totally by surprise.

David Jones [00:04:18]:

Yeah. How did you begin to notice the difference? Was it from feedback from your husband and presumably, the social workers?

Laurence Willis [00:04:30]:

I remember the very first therapy session we took our daughter to, and we sat down with the therapists, and they sat down with us first before they sat down with her, just to get parents voice. And, Lara said that she felt that I had issues and that I needed to speak to somebody. And I said, well, it’s not me, it’s her. And by this point we were only a few months into the adoption process with the kids settled with us, and it was already very stressful. And my other half is trained in working with children with complex needs and knows exactly how to handle these things. And I genuinely thought I was right and he was wrong in the way that, so we were parenting 180 degrees apart, and that was very challenging.

David Jones [00:05:44]:

Well, that must have been a terribly disorientating period for you.

Laurence Willis [00:05:52]:

Yeah, it was. I think when the professionals are telling you that you’ve got something wrong and you’re in such defiance of that, and you can’t see how they can be getting it so wrong, why are they looking at me? It’s clearly the kids. I think when you adopt any kids, I’ve learned very painfully over the years that you have to bring them up in a different way that you maybe might do birth children. And that style of bringing children up requires resilience and it requires patience and it requires you to really be an adult in the way that you model yourself, and I was definitely not that, and it was intensely difficult on my partner.

David Jones [00:07:00]:

I’m thinking that, you know, developing self-awareness is a challenge for all of us isn’t it? Have you been able to recognise what it was that helped you to make that turn, to be able to see that part of yourself that was operating?

Laurence Willis [00:07:22]:

No, David. It took me, when I eventually sat down with the therapist. So her social said that we as a couple needed therapy, therapeutic parenting supported by the Adoption Support Fund. We did a year of that therapy, and our therapist, a lady called Kate, who was a marvellous lady, eventually turned around and said, I can’t help you, Laurence. You’ve got so many issues, you need to see a therapist. This has to be our last session because you’re just not prepared to listen to anything we tell you. And that for me was a wake-up call. But even up until that point, they were telling me I had come from a very punitive upbringing, and I did not recognise that upbringing.

Laurence Willis [00:08:27]:

And my parents were strict, admittedly. They had their boundaries. We all had our responsibilities in the family to do because my parents were both holding down 2 full-time jobs, and life in Africa in those days, interest rates were 24%, so just keeping a mortgage over your head was difficult. So everybody had to pitch in and help, but I never saw my life as punitive, so it was very hard to accept that I needed to go into therapy. But I did, because she made it very clear to us that if I didn’t, our relationship would end very swiftly and we would lose, or I would lose the kids. And so I agreed to do 6 weeks of therapy with an amazing guy called Roy. And he said that we’ll just explore your upbringing and we’ll just help you to put it to bed. And that began the journey.

David Jones [00:09:46]:

Did it go on for longer than 6 weeks?

Laurence Willis [00:09:51]:

Yeah, it did, because in the very first session he wanted to create a timeline of my life. And by the end of the first session, we got to about the age of 15. And then in the second session, he said, I just want to touch on a part of your first session, just something you said, an event you commented on. And straight away my stomach was flipping and even before he told me where he wanted to go, I knew exactly where he wanted to go. And, he said, just tell me about this time when you were 10 years old, because I thought what had happened to me had happened at 10. And, that was the first time in, I was trying to work it out earlier, that was the first time in 27 years that particular bear had been poked. And within a minute of him starting to scratch, I was babbling, I was crying, I was totally distraught. And that was totally alien to anything I’ve done, the way I’ve behaved in terms of emotions for as far as I knew my whole life.

Naomi Murphy [00:11:24]:

Laurence, are you able to share just a little bit for listeners in terms of having some understanding of what happened when you were, when you were as you thought at the time, 10? Are you able to share a little bit to enable people to understand what it was that you were left then having to deal with? Only what you’re comfortable with.

Laurence Willis [00:11:44]:

Sure, I’ve been deeply, and I think the word I use is frightened because I think it is a very true word to how I feel. I’ve been deeply frightened that if the specific details of what they did ever got out into the public domain, it would give paedophiles actionable material that I think would devastate lives. So I guess without going into graphic detail, I think what matters most is there was definitely a profound betrayal of trust, particularly for somebody so young. I discovered through the therapy process and through some information my sister in South Africa gave me that I was actually 12, not 10, when the incident occurred. The man, his name was Frank, had built trust with my family over time. He invited me to Zimbabwe on a 2-week holiday, which was a hugely exciting opportunity to do because over the year before, or 12, 18 months before I’d really got to know him and chatted on the phone and letters. And I was always very excited to talk to him because he always made me feel good about myself on the phone and in his letters.

Laurence Willis [00:13:20]:

And he invited me to Zimbabwe, and when I arrived, I couldn’t wait coming out of the airport because I was so excited to be on my first arrivals hall. And I eventually made my way through into the area where he was sat waiting, and he was moody. He was quite annoyed with me. And that was quite intimidating for a, I was certainly a particularly immature child, and it was quite intimidating. And eventually we moved back to his home, pretty much a silent journey the whole way along. And once we arrived at his home, he became quite cheerful. Quite happy. He came over to where I was sat on the bed in the round rondavel, which is a thatched round house with a steepled roof, and he had nothing on but a pyjama top.

Laurence Willis [00:14:46]:

And he said to me, if you see me like this, it’s because I’ve forgotten you’re here. And then the phone rang and he went away. But what transpired after that was, he came back to me with the glass of what I was told was water, and he told me to drink it. And I initially didn’t want to drink the water, so I was looking for somewhere to place it. And he told me to drink it, and he actually got quite aggressive about it. And I remember his spit hitting my face, as he was telling me to drink it. And so I did. And I don’t remember what happened after that, but I remember waking up some time later to find myself drained, and what happened occurred and other physical activities happening that were very traumatising.

Laurence Willis [00:16:13]:

And that continued to some degree or the other for a total of 3 days.

Naomi Murphy [00:16:23]:

Thank you, Laurence. And you managed to escape at that point after being held captive really for 3 days?

Laurence Willis [00:16:40]:

Yeah and there were moments of safety in those. I forget now when it was, but I remember particularly, the gentleman Frank. I’d been crying because I’d been raped by another guy, and after the guy had left, he sat on his bed and he started to cry. And said to me, it was never meant to continue this long, I’m really sorry, something like that. And I felt quite sorry for him. But I also remember very early on in the journey thinking to myself, how on earth am I going to get away from this? That morning after the first night, I had been significantly bleeding. I didn’t know how I was going to get myself out of this situation. And I remember quite specifically my mum ringing on the second evening, and Frank had answered the phone, and he was very cheerful and chatty, as though nothing, and he passed the phone across to me and then put his hand on my head and was making sure that my answers were the right answers.

Laurence Willis [00:18:37]:

And my mum at one point said to me, she said, ‘Lo, are you okay?’ And I said, the pressure on my head was, ‘I’m homesick,’ was my reply.

Naomi Murphy [00:18:53]:

It must have been absolutely terrifying. You know, that would be a terrifying situation for an adult, never mind a 12-year-old little boy.

Laurence Willis [00:19:11]:

And the outcome of that was, on the second night, when the rape occurred, it had started with Frank putting his hand on my leg while we were playing cards, and then he started fondling me, and then somebody else entered the building, and they’re the person who raped me and were telling Frank to, yeah, so when the other person entered the room, I got the impression when the other person had entered the room that perhaps he was a younger guy. And he was angry, really. He was really angry to see me there with Frank. And in hindsight, I’ve wondered if maybe he had been raped by Frank or been abused by Frank at some point, because I remember Frank saying to him, I’ve got a new friend. And I remember him saying to Frank, we’ll see about that, and then, forcing me headfirst down onto the bed, and initially kneeling on my back, whilst he did things to my body that were incredibly painful. And then after that, I realised actually what was now causing the pain was his anatomy. And then he was trying to goad Frank into getting involved, and Frank didn’t.

Laurence Willis [00:21:06]:

And that’s the evening that Frank, then after he left, started to cry on the bed and say, I’m really sorry, this should have been over. This should have been over a lot earlier than that. Something like that. It’s gone out my head now. And then so on the third day, I started to come up with a plan. And my grandmother had very kindly, she had had concerns about me going to another country with an older man. And she had initially, before I went away, she was over on holiday in South Africa with my grandfather. And she had expressed those concerns to my mum, and my mum was reassuring her that we knew this man and it was all okay.

Laurence Willis [00:22:00]:

But what Gran said is, let’s give him some phone numbers in case. And one of those phone numbers was for somebody who was at the offices where the company my grandfather used to run and so the following day we were there, and he drove me to the offices because I said I want to see where my grandfather, Papa, used to work. And that guy had left, and the lady on reception was very dismissive. And I can remember getting quite emotional in the reception, asking if I could speak to him, and saying he’s not here. And I’m saying, where can you get a hold of him? And she just was very dismissive and said, I can’t give out numbers. So I left and I got back in the car and started crying. And I remember Frank smacking my head into the side of the door because I would not stop crying. And then that evening, or later afternoon, I started thinking, well, how can I make a phone call? How can I get out of this? And so I decided what I would try to do was replicate the hand on the leg on the basis that if he was alone, maybe I could then say, I need to go.

Laurence Willis [00:23:29]:

And I was very lucky. That’s exactly how it transpired out. He put his hand on my leg, I stood up, I said, I need to go. He said, where are you going to go? I said, I don’t know, I need to make a phone call. And he said to me, you can’t make a phone call here. So I had to walk up to the main house, on the plot or place he lived on and asked to use their phone there. And my brother’s godparents came and collected me. And all I said was that this gentleman had put a hand on my leg until they came to get me.

Laurence Willis [00:24:26]:

And after that point, I just, I started to cry heavily in the car, and I just remember Yvonne’s intensely beautiful, kind strength that she gave me through her grip of my hand. Eventually got back to their home, and it took a few days for me to get back, by which point I was becoming quite poorly, but a few days later, I was back in South Africa and back under the care of my parents.

Naomi Murphy [00:25:11]:

Utterly awful experience, Laurence. I mean, absolutely frightening, and it’s hard to imagine what that must have been like for you, actually, at that young age. And you can understand why you’d push that out of memory because it just sounds so overwhelmingly terrifying. And thank you for coming on here and being brave enough to tell your story, actually, because I think there are things that are helpful to learn from your experience. I was wondering about the process of recovering memories and how that occurred and whether you remembered all of that in one go, or whether things came back piece by piece and having to piece together a picture.

Laurence Willis [00:26:11]:

There was definitely no gentle build up. One minute I was sat in a session with Roy wondering how it will play out, talking about what I was feeling was punitive upbringing. And the next thing, something had broken through. And I remember Roy saying to me sometime later that when you’re safe, your brain releases. And the memories, which was incredibly disorientating, they came out in a totally wrong order. And not only did they come out in the wrong order, but they might only come out as a sentence at a time, or a smell at a time, or taste at a time. And, it was incredibly disorientating. Some were seconds long, some were, I can remember, sometimes just sitting there and my brain was hunting, literally.

Laurence Willis [00:27:29]:

It felt like for nearly 5 years, it felt like my brain was constantly hunting for detail. But it had a massive impact and I understand it now because I haven’t been able to read the whole book, but I was recommended to read a book. But my body started to change. I have got scars on my stomach that I have never understood, and truthfully, I’ve always been quite embarrassed about. I have never really known where they’ve come from, just that they’re there. And then all of a sudden I started to get some very significant stomach issues, which, eventually were seen by specialists here in the UK, and they were saying, we need to operate on these things, but these surgeries, these x-rays we’re looking at show that you’ve had the surgery before. And that then became a point where I would turn to my parents and ask for guidance as to why did I have the surgery. And it transpires that, as a result of what happened to me as a child, my body needed repairs.

Laurence Willis [00:29:10]:

And those repairs at the time were done. But by remembering everything in such detail, my body began to recreate the damage. So I’ve now had 3 operations, plus another extended period of time in hospital over the last 2 years. At 3 extended periods of time. And now I understand why I have that.

Naomi Murphy [00:29:51]:

So probably worth just saying for the benefit of listeners, it might sound quite fantastical to hear about someone having to have surgery twice in the same area, but actually it’s not that unusual for survivors of abuse, for their body to present with injuries that are consistent with the original trauma. So I have known people kind of like wake up with two black eyes, for instance, when they hadn’t been hit, but that their body was, you know, they were working on physical trauma from childhood. So to anyone listening, this might sound really out of the scope of their comprehension, but it’s within the field of trauma, it’s not unusual for people to have this kind of experience. Laurence, I wondered how this had affected your identity, you know, to go from being somebody who sounded quite carefree and happy and really well-functioning to then having to deal with this, all this awful episode in your life.

Laurence Willis [00:30:57]:

It’s had a massive impact on my identity. I went from being a cheerful, friendly, happy person who was always the person who wanted to be around loads of people to being the person who could not be around anybody. It affected my relationship, because I could not allow Mark to even touch me, and so that was intensely difficult on him. It affected my ability to be a professional in my job because triggers could happen at any time, any place. And it caused me to see myself as a risk to other people, and it caused me to see myself as somebody with a mental health problem because no doubt about it, I thought I was definitely suicidal. But then there’s also, my mum used to say to me over the years of the therapy, she would say, don’t let this define you. But actually, I think I wouldn’t have walked through this, but I think it has probably started to create me. I have started to find, particularly over the last 2 years since I stopped therapy and my brain began to gradually move from shock to the ability to operate again, I’ve started to seem a real purpose for my life.

Laurence Willis [00:32:49]:

And that purpose is, this is the first time I’m really talking about this, but I’m a lot more open about the fact that I’ve been abused. I have to be, which has been quite tricky. I’ve had to be open with my abuse on my company website, I talk about it. There’s a small section. If I meet people socially, I talk about it. And I do that because I’m very conscious that my brain will forget, or try to forget, everybody and everything. It doesn’t seem to do it professionally, but it does certainly do it socially. And people would get angry with me that we might have spent a whole afternoon together, and then I see them a week later, a month later, and I have got zero knowledge of that connection.

Laurence Willis [00:33:51]:

Whereas as I move away from that trauma state, my brain is a lot more able to contribute and to share and to consider and express how I feel. And hopefully over time it’ll feel more able to add real value to other people.

David Jones [00:34:18]:

And do you now feel safe in the world, Laurence?

Laurence Willis [00:34:37]:

I don’t know if I know really how to answer that.

David Jones [00:34:44]:

No, that’s okay. I was thinking back to your description of how you were so hypervigilant earlier on in this conversation and wondered whether those kind of states had eased or changed in any way?

Laurence Willis [00:35:10]:

I’m a lot less hypervigilant, so I’m managing my triggers a lot better. I guess I feel safer that I can go in somewhere and I can sit and I don’t have to constantly be looking over, particularly my left shoulder for some reason. No, it was the right shoulder. I think it must be my right shoulder. I would always be looking over one shoulder. I don’t know how to answer that in all honesty. I think I will always, I remember, maybe a year and a half ago, maybe 2 years ago my colleagues in the office took a phone call, and the caller said they wanted to talk to me, and it would have to do with this gentleman, and they gave his full name. And I couldn’t return their phone call.

Laurence Willis [00:36:32]:

My brain just would not let me. And a period of time went by, and they called my mobile one day. This unknown international number phones me. And this person says to me, hello, are you Laurence Willis? And I say yes. And, did you know Frank? And I said yes. And next thing she’s in tears, and I can hear another woman in tears in the same room as her. And after they’ve calmed a bit, they tell me that they have, whilst clearing up their parents’ house, they found a box full of A4 envelopes filled with polaroid photographs. And my envelope had my name on the front with all these photographs, but my photographs did not show end of life.

Laurence Willis [00:37:42]:

And they had found me because my envelope also was the only envelope that had personal letters in it. So I must have been the only person who knew. So in some respects, that was deeply affirming because it confirmed to me that there was truth in my recollections. Because I think when you don’t have the memory and the memory comes back, even if other people believe you, it’s hard to believe yourself. And my parents were initially very dismissive, very defensive almost, that my memories were not true. It was only after my sisters got involved and told my mum and dad that they needed to share what they remembered because they were also going to share what they remembered, that I started to believe that I was not having a schizophrenic breakdown or a mental health breakdown. And then I got this phone call from these ladies and it was surprisingly calming.

Laurence Willis [00:39:00]:

Because it told me that there was evidence out there. And very, sadly, and I wish they hadn’t done it, they hung up and I’ve never heard anything since. And I hope that they’ve done the right thing and given the evidence to somebody rather than maybe just dispose of it, and particularly if there’s other individuals involved, but when you ask, do I feel safe, I haven’t felt safe because, and I don’t know if I should say this really, I remember my therapist saying to me that people have been abused, many people who’ve been abused go on to abuse. And that was deeply frightening for me because I thought, I do not want to ever be one of those people. So as a consequence of that, when you ask, do I feel safe, I wonder if safety means I don’t ever place myself in any position where I’m ever around children on my own. It’s not because I doubt who I am. I don’t ever believe I could ever do anything to a child, but I definitely am very mindful that other people might think that.

Naomi Murphy [00:40:37]:

And just to be clear again for any listeners, it’s like the proportion of people who go on to sexually offend who have that in their history, it’s a tiny minority. You know, the vast majority of survivors do not go on to abuse children. And I know that people become very frightened of that possibility, or that fear that people will believe that. And it sounds like that’s been quite clumsily worded to you, where you’re left carrying a sense of responsibility for other people’s perceptions when, you know, people who start to offend sexually start that typically in their teenage years. It’s not behaviour that starts in, in your 40s.

Laurence Willis [00:41:20]:

Yeah, and it’s interesting that because now I work as a trustee with Mankind, the men’s sexual abuse charity, or men who have been affected by unwanted sexual experiences is the correct phrase. And one of the things we talk about, which was quite an eye-opener for me, was people who could be perpetrators, and it’s about not shaming them but supporting them. And that has been a real interesting mindset, mind shift change for me, because I realised, you know, if somebody has those feelings actually, they can be helped with the right support, the right guidance. They can be helped. Whereas perhaps at the start of this journey 8 years ago, I would definitely not have felt that. I would have, I was angry. I went through a process of, if I could have, I would probably, if the opportunity allowed myself, I would probably have killed him.

Laurence Willis [00:42:40]:

If I could have. Whereas now I can see that people who have that, there can be hope. Does that make sense?

Naomi Murphy [00:42:57]:

It does make sense, Laurence, absolutely. And I wondered, as a man, how easy it has been to access appropriate support and help that you might need?

Laurence Willis [00:43:12]:

I was very lucky initially because of course my initial therapy went through the Adoption Support Fund, so that was the initial 6 weeks, and the extended period that went to 6 months came from my son’s therapy. Together or put away what they had started to uncover. But after about 4 months into the 6 months, Roy had to begin to close down the sessions because I was severely unstable and we got a slight extension, but the sessions had to come to an end, and I then struggled to find a therapist. And I found a lady who was wonderful. I forget her name now, but she had to stop the therapy because she, I hope I’m not misremembering this, but, my recollection is she had to stop the therapy because she needed to protect her mental health because my story was quite, coming out with so much detail, and it was quite difficult for her. And after that, I couldn’t find therapy. I was on waiting lists. I was becoming suicidal.

Laurence Willis [00:44:50]:

And I found myself up at Beachy Head on 3 separate occasions, and I think it was the second occasion I was really ready. It was my day. I can remember parts of it. I can remember being intensely close to the cliff, but thinking I was just trying to get that um, strength up and I don’t remember what happened after that, but my next part of that memory is, and somehow I got from Beachy Head back to Haywards Heath and had driven to the doctor’s surgery, and I just sat in the waiting room initially for a period of time, don’t know how long. And a receptionist came out a few times, and then a nurse came out to see me, and eventually a doctor came out to see me and said, come to my rooms. And he was amazing. He was an absolutely brilliant gentleman called Dr. Standen, and he was, he listened and he said to me, I’m gonna call you every few days and I’m going to try and get you in to see the NHS mental health team.

Laurence Willis [00:46:27]:

And that began a journey of support until I eventually decided I didn’t want to go down the drugs route, and I found I couldn’t find anybody who could deal with my trauma. I did, funnily enough, I did approach organisations like Mankind, but at that point my suicidal tendencies meant I was not stable enough to go into therapy, and that meant I didn’t know where to turn. Kind of made me feel a bit hopeless, I guess. But I eventually found my neighbour who was a therapist but not a trauma therapist. And after his supervisor gave him permission to work with me because we were too close living together, he became my therapist and was probably for 3 years, I think.

Naomi Murphy [00:47:26]:

Doesn’t sound like an easy journey. That sounds incredibly challenging to access support when you’re wanting it.

Laurence Willis [00:47:38]:

No, you’re absolutely right, because, as you know, since we first met each other, I myself have been on the journey of talking about male suicide, and when I see and increasingly learn about how the high levels of male suicide, and then on Christmas Day, a close friend right underneath my nose took his life. I realised actually, and I remember him 6 months before sending a WhatsApp to me saying, I can’t get the right support for my mental health. And I missed the sign. I totally missed the sign. And it is intensely hard for anybody, I think. And it’s very easy for us to say, reach out if you need to talk, reach out if anybody needs to talk, reach out. But actually, having been there, when you need to reach out, you can’t. Your brain, your body, your stomach will not let you communicate.

Laurence Willis [00:48:48]:

And you’re afraid of what people think, and you don’t want to be a nuisance to people, and you don’t know what to say. And I think people are scared that if somebody does reach out, will they get involved in something that is intensely personal and maybe intensely difficult for them? So that reaching out is a message we need to somehow normalise.

Naomi Murphy [00:49:14]:

Yeah. Thank you, Laurence. One of the things I find remarkable about you, Laurence, is you’ve got a kind of gentle thoughtfulness about you. And I know you gave a lot of consideration as to what to share on this, in this conversation, and really thinking through the impact, the potential impact on other people. I think it’d be very easy to get eaten up with rage at what’s happened to you. Do you have any advice for others who may go through the process of recovering memories?

Laurence Willis [00:49:45]:

A rage is a very good word, and I don’t think I avoided it. I think I have absolutely felt it at different points. There were moments for me certainly of deep anger at what happened, at the people involved, what I felt at the time were the systems that failed me or the people that failed me. And definitely anger at myself. I blamed myself for what happened. So I don’t think rage is necessarily the enemy. I think it’s often our nervous system’s way of trying to tell us that should never have happened. But, my advice to survivors who are beginning this journey is firstly, I would say be kind to yourself.

Laurence Willis [00:50:50]:

Understand that other people’s recollections may differ, and that doesn’t necessarily mean that yours are untrue. It just means that they remember it differently, or that they’re trying to protect themselves or their role in your journey, in your story, in your trauma. I would say go slowly, and if you can avoid pulling out every single detail like I felt I had to, then try not to. Because I think I delayed my recovery by trying to pull every single detail out. And I’m very consciously aware that there’s probably still stuff out there but I have to work hard now to make sure that doesn’t come out.

Naomi Murphy [00:51:42]:

It’s a really, really astute observation there, because I think some therapists do feel you have to kind of be able to work on every detail of a narrative to make it less, to resolve it and make it less traumatic. But more sort of contemporary approaches to trauma don’t require that at all. You know, it’s not important to go into the heart of a memory. What you need is a sliver of the experience that evokes the emotion. And so things like EMDR, sensory motor psychotherapy, somatic approaches will work with what’s there in the body rather than trying to piece together a complete narrative from start to finish, because that’s just too traumatic for people to relive that experience at times.

Laurence Willis [00:52:30]:

Yeah, you’re absolutely right. I think listening to people like yourself, and your approach to this is very stabilising. And I think what I’ve begun to see happening through the likes of LinkedIn is there is a lot of trauma-informed therapy out there now, which I think, I don’t know if I’m right on this one, but I feel like it’s growing in awareness. And I guess the last thing I wonder is, whilst people who are going through their memories and their memories are resurfacing or they’re processing them, they may never forget them. Those memories, once they’re back, I think will stay with them forever, but it will become easier.

Naomi Murphy [00:53:36]:

Thank you, Laurence. Thank you so much for having the courage to come on and share your story, and hopefully people listening will be able to take something from the understanding of your experience in dealing with recovering a really difficult period in that process, you know, navigating the way forward from that. So really appreciative of you coming on to share this story with us today.